#260 - Where is the AI bandwagon heading ? With Lee Houghton

[00:00:02] Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of Get Out of Wrap. This one's going to really annoy Barry because he's back again. Not Barry, but Lee Houghton from Get Knowledge, the UK's National Coach of the Year. Frequent visitor to Get Out of Wrap, good friend.

[00:00:26] And we are jumping on the bandwagon, but maybe to have a look at the wheels and the direction of the bandwagon and think whether this is a good thing to be travelling towards. But Lee, welcome. Oh Mr Teasdale, honestly it's an absolute pleasure to just chat with you again. I call my daughter the little bundle of joy.

[00:00:55] But you are an absolute bundle of fun for me. So yeah, honestly a pleasure to be chatting to you again. Well thank you. I'm not sure some of my family would agree with that post-marathon. I'm a bit post-marathon blues, a bit grumpy, but I'm getting there. But we are going to be talking about something that's called AI.

[00:01:20] Yeah, it's a new phrase, isn't it? I'm not sure whether many of your listeners have heard of it. I mean it's everywhere, isn't it? It is everywhere. And we are all becoming more and more accustomed to it being everywhere. And we both had the privilege and pleasure of attending the forum conference and expo earlier this week.

[00:01:42] And there was a lot of talk and conversations about it there. And I think for all of its good, I think there's a real danger with it as well. And I think it might be worth just exploring some of those dangers and challenges of this silver bullet that they call AI. Yeah, and I think it's worth noting that neither one of us are Luddites.

[00:02:07] You know, we were sat next to each other for most of the day at the conference talking about the merits of all the different AI that we utilize and how we utilize it and different, whether it's a gadget or whether we're ChatGPT and should we now be thinking about Claude. And for both of us, we're both kind of solo business owners on the slog every day.

[00:02:36] And over the, you know, let's be on nearly two years, I think we've both shared how massively helpful it's been to helping us navigate tricky situations, structuring how we might want to keep spinning all of our different plates. It's the go-to when you're thinking about business admin, tax, whatever it may be.

[00:03:03] So we're huge fans and users. Yeah. But we've both shared and talked about what's it doing to us? Because I really like this thing that says, I think it was Erica Farmer that first said this. I was listening to her talk and she's great about AI. And it was, AI is as bad as it's ever going to be right now. Yes. Wow.

[00:03:33] It's only going to get, it'll get better tomorrow. It'll be better again the day after. Yeah. And there's so many implications to that. Yeah. Wow. I mean, yeah, they're right. They're right. It is absolutely transformational and it is helping and providing so much value for businesses of all sizes and scales.

[00:04:01] And it's easy to see why there is so much noise and positivity and use of it. Like you said, it helps us in various different ways. And it is helping a lot of people. And you're dead right. It's only going to be as bad as it is now. And that's a frightening thing to say, isn't it?

[00:04:27] If we just think about how we've used it over maybe the last 12 to 18 months and just how much more we can use it now than we could 18 months ago and what it's doing different. And just how it brings large volumes of things together and produces what it produces in such a short space of time is transformative. Transformative.

[00:04:56] But I do have a little fear with it. I do have a little fear. Can I share my little fear? Yeah, please do. Yes. Thank you. It's just between you and me.

[00:05:07] Like, I think, like, we, because more and more people are using it and we are becoming lazier as, and maybe less creative and more reliant upon the answers that it's providing. I feel like we will become less human because of AI.

[00:05:34] The things that make us beautiful in our own individual ways are the things that I fear we're going to not continue to hone our craft.

[00:05:46] Connection, human relationships, creativity, thinking, decision-making, all of those things, the things that make us special and we become less practiced in because we've gotten easier answers from the use of AI. Do you have the same fear or is this just a fear for me? I do. I do. But I think, and we'll, I'm sure we can get into this.

[00:06:15] I absolutely do. But this does remind me of, we listen to the Ricky Gervais, Carl Pilkington and Steve Merchant podcast every single night. And I have done for 11, 12, for as long as I can remember. But I practically know all of them, words to word.

[00:06:38] And in one of them, they're challenging Carl because they say Carl doesn't like the development of technology. Now, bearing in mind, these podcasts are over 20 years old, yeah? When they first started talking. And he's talking about SatNav. So when SatNav first came out and he said, it's making us all lazy. And Ricky Gervais says, well, why?

[00:07:05] And he said, well, when you were traveling somewhere, you used to know how, which way you were going. You'd say, right, I'm getting the A34 and then I'm going to get the M40 and then the M1 and it's junction 12. He said, now we're just getting lazy. We're just letting SatNav do it. And Ricky Gervais kind of picks that apart a little bit and says, well, you know, we've gone from the compass to, you know, they didn't say to Christopher Columbus, how are you getting there? Yeah. You're using the stars.

[00:07:35] He went, no, no, I'm using the compass. Oh, lazy. You know, and it's as technology's evolved and even if you think not just from how you're driving around, but where you're using AI to get quick answers.

[00:07:53] I think where there's real merit to what you're saying is in, whether it is in business and putting a proposal together or sending an email to someone or doing a LinkedIn post, all the way down to sort of education with people producing coursework and things like that.

[00:08:17] But it's so good now, you technically can do it and not be involved in it, not really use it to pique your interest or make a good point. You can just go, here's what I want to know. It's all about how you're putting the prompts in, get a good result. And I haven't really engaged in that topic. I've just got an answer I'm happy with and away it goes.

[00:08:47] And if you take whether they're LinkedIn posts, I think you could argue that we are evolving, that we're getting better at spotting what is 99% AI. Because there is no flavour of who the person is behind that. No matter how many times it might say at the point, would you like this to be more playful?

[00:09:15] I think we've got better at spotting it. But I do share your concerns around what we're doing whilst this is taking place. Are we just observers or are we going to take the output and think, okay, what bits of that help will I use versus I'm not really part of this activity. I've put my prompt in. I've got the answer.

[00:09:45] There you go. And then the response back to you is also AI driven. And you could just say, tell me when we've made the sale or tell me to prompt me when there's a result to your communication with John. But it's not really John. It's just John using Claude. Correct. Yes, John and Claude. First thing, can you just do your Ricky Gervais, ooh, lazy voice again. That was very impressive. Ooh, lazy.

[00:10:15] I didn't realise you could do impressions as well. Amazing. You're a man of many talents and that's why you were a bundle of fun. And then, so I find myself nodding along with you, but also disagreeing with you internally with some things, which I quite like actually.

[00:10:35] Because although I do nod along with the logic that you're saying, I do think being human and all of the things that I really value in us as a person, as human beings, as human beings. And I recognise that this is just an individual thing. It's the thing. This is like, I think it's a muscle we have to practise a lot.

[00:10:58] Um, like, um, building connection, making friends, um, conversing in a meaningful way, building trust. Um, uh, like getting to know people on a, like who they are, all of, all of those things. And then when I think about an inner business context, I always say that the two most important metrics in any organisation never measured are the number of new thoughts we are creating in our people.

[00:11:26] And then the lead time from those thoughts being had to conversations taking place and then actions happening. And there could be an argument to say that AI is helping us think new things. Um, and, and it could very well be, um, and it is in a number of instances. Um, there could be an argument to also say that AI will also help us, um, have those conversations and also take action in them.

[00:11:54] Um, but if, but I think my fear comes from it's removal of the other people in the equation. And I think that's the thing for me. It's the, it's the connectedness of humanity. Um, and the working on this, um, that the must, the human muscle of, of just connecting in a human thing. I think that's the thing as we're talking now that, that I fear.

[00:12:22] Like there's a lot of people now working from home and who may say that they talk to Claude more than they do Colin who lives next door or Colin from the office and stuff. And like, and it, that's where I think the fear is stemming from. We are losing the art or potentially practicing being human through overutilisation of AI. Yeah. I wouldn't, I wouldn't disagree.

[00:12:54] We're agreeably disagreeing on some things, which is nice, isn't it? It is. Yeah, it is. But it doesn't this, but doesn't this present an opportunity for people to lean into the distinctly human part of, of connection? Yeah.

[00:13:14] Because you could say AI is doing a lot of the bollocks mongering and we're focusing on the, the emotions and the, and the meaningful stuff. It is funny. Like I devour the news via the BBC app on my phone. I've always been reading through it. And some of their in-depth articles I really like started reading them.

[00:13:39] And then at the very, and I read one and at the very bottom, it said this was part of a trial of this article has been written by AI, but it has been sense checked, edited by one of our editorial staff. Yeah.

[00:13:57] And it made me, it was weird because reading, reading that made me go, oh, I felt like instinctually kind of like a bit like, oh no, I don't think I like that. If it hadn't have been there, I wouldn't have noticed. I wouldn't have noticed that. The article, it was really interesting. Happy days. But seeing that kind of disclaimer at the bottom was a little bit like, oh, I'm not sure how I feel about this.

[00:14:27] I don't know why. I have nothing more to add. I think the first thing you said there is, and this is where I agree wholeheartedly is this is a huge opportunity for us to face into. And I hope everybody recognizes the opportunity to face into the recognizing the human qualities that we don't want to lose.

[00:14:53] Creativity, curiosity, connection, and doubling down on those things rather than purely just doubling down on the technology roadmaps and things like that. We need to recognize the human aspect of these, face into these and work extra hard. It's like when COVID happened and everybody went working from home.

[00:15:15] Lots of people felt isolated because they couldn't have the water cooler conversations and things with their colleagues. And so teams have had to learn how to create those connection moments just in a different way. And I really hope people are embracing the human side of AI and the things that we're missing that we just need to really double down on.

[00:15:43] Like we still have loads of meetings and I encourage teams to have, like if you have an hour long meeting, like the first five minutes should be a connect. The last five minutes need to be reflect. So we connect for five minutes and reflect for five minutes at the end and you have a 15 minute meeting in between because if you just ask one new question to get to know everybody in the room for the first five minutes. What did you have for dinner, for example? Exact perfect. The perfect question.

[00:16:11] And then the, uh, the, the last five minutes, like what, what are we all taking away or what have we all heard today in this, in this last conversation or all of those things. Then, then we are still providing those moments to connect. And I think that is exactly where I'm agreeing with you.

[00:16:28] We need to face into this, understand the human impact and work extra hard to create those moments like, like of curiosity without just asking your, your Claude or your chat GPT's or your perplexities. The question, how can we get the knowledge of the people in the room, make everybody think as well? It's interesting, isn't it?

[00:16:54] Because the other day me and you were both talking about whether we should move our AI that we both use individually from chat GPT to Claude. And it was kind of, I think you said something along the lines of like chat GPT knows me so well. It's got all my history and it's, it's like, I don't want to leave chat GPT for cool. Yeah. I'm connected to an AI. Yeah.

[00:17:23] It knows me better than I do sometimes. Which is frightening. But I, I, I, I do, I do completely agree that it's, um, I also wonder about the, what the intellectual, um, impact.

[00:17:39] But again, does that just mean the real lived experience in a topic with all, all of the failures that go into becoming good at something become even more important? Because at a cursory level, I could just go onto my other screen right now and go, tell me everything I need to know to be able to go to a scuba diving conference and fit in.

[00:18:10] And it's, and it's going to give me everything. And I could just remember this parrot fashion and go out there, go out there and do it. But I, I have no lived experience of scuba diving, but it does, you know, it, it, that element, I guess, is something, I'm not sure if concern is the right word. It's more like how our relationship to knowledge, understanding how we use it is changing.

[00:18:39] It has to be changed. It has to be changed. In, in the same way that the internet changed everything, you know, that we are, um, the amount of information at our fingertips or that we are just bombarded with is, is changing how we think. Yeah. And it, and it's soon then going to change. It has changed our behaviors and will continue to do so.

[00:19:07] How do we ensure that that is something that's all that's to our benefit across all of the different things? You know, a lot of your work, you talk about head, hands, heart, uh, you know, and again, that kind of is going to come as we're going to probably be even more important than pre AI. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:19:32] How do we leverage it to work better together as humans? Um, it's, yeah, it is, it is the human thing. It like, and what, when you said about that, the head, hands and hearts, then, um, when, when I think about AI, we are using AI a lot for, um, for the, so the head is like the intellectual stimulation.

[00:19:57] And, um, and the thoughts that we're creating and, um, and the thoughts that we're creating and we are using, we are outsourcing some of that to AI. The hands part of it, we are outsourcing some of the physical activity or the, uh, the transactional activity to AI, um, and bots and stuff. So we are outsourcing some of the things that I think are important for, for human, like to, to get, um, job satisfaction and, and, and development from.

[00:20:26] Um, the heart part of it, we are never outsourcing. And I think that's the, that's the thing for me is recognizing that the AI will never take, never, never take the heart, um, of, uh, of, of people.

[00:20:41] But like, because we are outsourcing some of the thinking and thoughts and outsourcing some of the action and stuff, how can we maintain our level of humanness to have this level of, of strength of connection to each other without being isolated? Um, I've, I've used a lot of words. I'm not sure I made any sense with what I said. Well, I've got, I've, I'll ask Chuck TPT. I've got into this. Did he make any sense? Yeah. Yeah.

[00:21:09] So summarize this podcast in, uh, in, in 30 seconds. Um, I mean, that's another, but like, so I sometimes use perplexity to put, you can put in a YouTube video, um, into perplexity and analyze it. And it gives you the top two or three things, but I've not put any thinking into that. And, and like, um, the danger of that is like, if I'm watching a video, I'm turning up to watch that video based on my experience, my level of education, my current circumstance.

[00:21:39] And every time we are speaking or whatever time we listen, we may resonate with different things at different times based on where we currently are. Um, if I'm just putting everything into perplexity and going, it's just summarizing what it believes based on the, maybe the, the frequency of words or the intent of the conversation. Um, to summarize the important points. Um, like we may, like, I don't know, you, you, you may have read a book or watch the film multiple times.

[00:22:07] And every time you take something different because you're turning up at a different place. Um, and it's, it's these things that, that I don't want us to miss. You are still thinking in that scenario though. You, you found perplexity. You're, you're, you've decided that you're going to use it to summarize the, the YouTube video.

[00:22:29] And again, I agree that you're not going to have the same experience, but it's, and this isn't a diss you, by the way, but it is probably going to be more accurate than if you were taking your own notes. Right.

[00:22:45] In an, in absolutely based on the overall summary of what it's observing, but the, the, the things that I may have taken away as the most important things might be different because I'm turning up as a, in a, maybe in a different place based on what is currently happening to me. So it's, it's removing the opportunity for me to think those things. And it's just given me a generic thing that, that I've got to choose. Um, but it might be the same thing. It might not.

[00:23:15] Um, I also wonder about interest as well. Like, for example, if you're interested and want to know about what's going on in the middle East, you could get great summary within seconds. Yep.

[00:23:33] Um, but if you wanted to, if you wanted to find out more, you'd want to hear from experts and humans, you'd, you'd want to, it might help you understand the different, um, sides, factions, history, but actually the nuance you'd go now recommend a great documentary.

[00:23:59] Or, or, or people I can listen to who are experts on in the, in the subject, because they're going to give you something more than what is a, still a comprehensive. You, you still kind of moved forward in your understanding. Yeah. But it's never going to be quite as good in that area. It won't be as good as this guy's been a diplomat involved in both sides for 20 years.

[00:24:25] And he's going to talk you through why there hasn't been a peace agreement or, or, or whatever. But there's still, there is still some thinking. I think one of the things that always intrigues me is inclusion and exclusion in the whole, in the AI, in the AI world.

[00:24:47] So has it, has it helped people who previously might've been excluded in society get access to work, access to connection, um, help them, um, you know, whether that is because of a physical or mental vulnerability disability, that AI has been doing some wonderful things to, to help.

[00:25:14] But equally, I think there's also exclusion that is a bit of a concern. Like the, again, we assume everyone's using it. Companies are using it. People are using it. And that's not, that's not necessarily the case at all. Um, who, the people that are being excluded, are they being left behind and left behind at a startling rate?

[00:25:41] You know, is it kind of, um, is it something to be concerned about? And equally on the inclusion thing, I do know that there are people that I respect that say it's probably not being used enough for minority groups and, uh, and things like that.

[00:26:00] So again, yeah, it's just another one that I wrestle with on the topic of AI, how inclusive it is or how people are being excluded from, from it. Yeah. I think that's really important. Like, yeah. Um, a little story popped into my head. So my, uh, my nan, uh, she's 98 years old and she pays her, all of her bill or the majority of her bill by a checkbook. And, and not a lot of people know her accepting checks. So she's been excluded from the way that she's done.

[00:26:30] It's just a, it's just technology moving on, isn't it? For, for, for different reasons, um, uh, as well. And, and I think like, I guess just to summarize, um, AI for me, that everything we spoke about comes down to how we use it. Um, the, and, and if we reframed AI, so give it a, and still say AI, but if we had a different definition for it and it's actual intention.

[00:26:58] And if we understood our actual intention behind like when we use it, why we using it, what we're going to miss, who are we going to miss? Um, and then I think we could be in a, in a far better, but more inclusive place for, for everybody, but also for, for us as individuals. We might be more curious. We might be more creative. We can use the outputs in a, in a better way to bring people together.

[00:27:28] It comes down to the actual intention of every leader, of every person, of every business and how we are adopting AI. And are we doing it just to cut costs or are we doing it to succeed in the longterm? Um, I think there's some fascinating society based questions as well.

[00:27:51] There's people who say where this is heading is heading to a place where humans, we will get far more leisure time because everything is, a lot of the other stuff is being done by AI. Yeah.

[00:28:11] But that, I always, I've always got a problem with that because I think that assumes that there's coalesced thought around where things are heading. Even if you look at business, right? It's not like leaders are getting together and thinking about the intent of why they're, they're using it. Everyone is, everyone's doing something that they believe is for the best for the business.

[00:28:36] And, and it's, and it's even less coordinated, I think, from a governments or leaders of people in society point of view. Yeah. Who, who knows where we're heading? Because in the, in the picture that I've read some people paint, it's like we, we will, we'll just, the biggest thing that we're going to have to adjust to is that we're going to have more spare time.

[00:29:03] And that could be great because we're going to, there'll be a boom in arts and hobbies and, and things like that. But I always come, I always come back to like, who's paying for, am I still being paid in this, in this scenario? Like how, how is, how is all this going to work? This, um, this wonderful future state that you just can't, I find that hard to believe. I'd like it, I'd like it to be true.

[00:29:31] And I do think it prompts a lot of thought when you go to the extreme as to, you know, what, what's next? What else are we going to be using AI for? And your earlier point about your nan, I think is really interesting because we're an aging population. Yeah. And again, it's that kind of exclusion that the gap is, is the gap going to get wider?

[00:29:55] I mean, and we haven't even touched on people that are using this for nefarious means and whether that is, you know, incite, inciting division and hatred or all the way to criminals using it with ever more sophistication. Um, it's a minefield. It is. I was hoping you were going to solve it, to be honest. That was my aim. Yeah. Apologies. Maybe, maybe I need to be. Not there yet. Yeah.

[00:30:23] No, maybe I need to be invited back on just to really annoy Barry. And, uh, yeah, like when, uh, when we were at the, um, the, the forum, uh, the, the forum conference, uh, earlier this week, like there was one person in the audience. So they did loads of amazing group discussions and one of the tables fed back at the end. And they said about the impact of AI and they spoke about the organizational structures will no longer be triangles.

[00:30:48] They said that it's likely to be a diamond because of the, the work that, um, the AI will replace. We'll, we'll make it more of a diamond hierarchical structure in organization. Will it be a diamond or will it just be a smaller triangle? Um, will it, will we have both? Uh, will it just, will it be a rectangle? I don't, there's lots of, I don't think we know yet, do we? And I think your, your point from about 15 minutes ago about we need to just face into it and we need to embrace it.

[00:31:19] And we need to, that's exactly what we need to do. Um, but we need to understand really and truly why are we using it and how can we bring all of our people, um, with us both intellectually, physically, and emotionally, um, as well. So, no, I can't fix it today for you. Um, but I think there's, there's a lot of things that are really exciting about it. There are.

[00:31:49] I think it's right. I think it's right to be cautious as well though. You can be enthusiastic, but still cautious, right? You can, um, there is, whether it is LinkedIn or certainly in the contact center world, notes will be standardized. You don't need to, uh, agents don't need to worry about taking notes and putting them in. And it's so funny, but that small thing made me think, you know what?

[00:32:18] That I can, that's so obviously meant to be a good thing. But I know for my time being an agent, if I was talking to you and I, I would just go, if I have to come back and sort of talk to you again, it's going to be very hard for me to remember you.

[00:32:38] So I would add things in there like, um, something we might've spoken about or something that happened or, um, you had a parrot in the background that go has, has a noisy parrot in background. You know, will those things, will those things be gone? And I think it, I, that's quite a leap to go from there to like personality and the interest you can find in different people's personalities.

[00:33:07] But you're only, you know, LinkedIn, for example, where we get to read, we've connected to lots and lots of people, but we might not have ever physically met them. So you can go by how they're showing up and what they post. I think it's got better, but there's so, there was certainly a time when I was thinking so many of the posts I'm reading are AI that it, it's a copy and paste. And some people actually did copy and paste without taking out the bottom bit.

[00:33:37] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's the uncomfortable truth about AI, isn't it? Uncomfortable truth is in majority of the AI course, isn't it? It's a, and it does make things easier, quicker, faster, uh, content, better structured, um, as well in, in some instances. Um, but as I get a lot of, I need to get things out of my head and get stuff onto paper.

[00:34:03] And there's a process that helps me like declutter my brain and, and I need to write some stuff, um, to, to, to get it out to clear. Yeah. And so I think it comes down to like, what's our actual intention. So that's what AI for me, um, in summary for this, this conversation is that's what it means. That's what we need to really think about is what's our actual intention.

[00:34:24] And, and what are we going to do to make it better for, for everybody, not just faster, quicker, simpler, but more enjoyable, um, and allow us to think more, be more curious and just develop humanity. Um, as well, quite, quite a grand, uh, summary of that for me. Well, it, it, it's great. Can we go back to the Rickard Gervais impression?

[00:34:55] Lazy. Um, but you know, this is that I could have read that as a AI summary. It was that good, but it, it wouldn't have had your face, your laugh, you know, the, the, the, the winning smile and things, and things like that. Oh, stop it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's a, I mean, this is, this is a challenge. It's a conversation that we'll rumble on for, uh, for, uh, for a lot longer. Um, but we've just got to embrace it, haven't we?

[00:35:25] Um, and we've just got to, because like you said, right at the start, like AI is not going to be as bad as it is today. And we as humans need to get better as well. I was, I think there will be opportunity to lean into non AI stuff that maybe we'd not used in the, so much recently.

[00:35:55] Like someone gave me a physical business card the other day and I thought, Oh, that's kind of cool. Uh, retro. Yeah. Yeah. But it, it, you know, things like that will, will, will there be greater take up on doing things more face to face? Will there be like, you go to activities and things like that, where it's, it's part of the rules that there's no AI involved.

[00:36:22] I don't know if, I think for every, for every movement within society, there's also like, there's always a counter, a counter movement with people saying, no, we're going to, we are going to show up as humans. We're going to, there's going to be more, um, personal contact and things like that. And, you know, I mentioned education right at the start.

[00:36:41] Education is trying to ensure that people aren't just using AI to get their, um, qualifications that they're trying to engender more kind of conversation. And still what we'd know is like historical re ways to research. Um, it is fascinating, but you can't be, you can't just be a fascinated observer. Because it's, we're using it, it's happening.

[00:37:11] And if we come back to what me and you do, surely we're always trying to find a way to, to do more, to be more efficient. And to, for that to cost less. Yeah. I'm sure there's experts that could come in and say, you guys are not even, this is the tip of the iceberg you're using. You should be doing X, Y, and Z. And we kind of, we chase that ourselves. We talk about it a lot, don't we?

[00:37:38] We're going like, how can we, how can we utilize it to get more, more efficient? But isn't that just to free up more time for you to do the human part of what you're, what you do? Yeah. Yeah. And, and it is two sides of the same coin, isn't it? Like we have to, we have to embrace it to find the right solutions to help us move forward.

[00:38:03] But then without losing our ability to challenge our own thoughts and thinking, we need to help. We need to use it to further our thinking, further our curiosity, further our creativity and further our human connection. And I think as long as that's our actual intention behind it, then my fear subsides. However, it grows if we don't, if we're not using it in that way.

[00:38:33] It has helped me with one of my biggest fears though. And I mean, my biggest fear is that Tottenham get relegated from the Premier League, looking like a certainty. And ChatGPT has helped me kind of accept it and think, you know, what, what other thing, you know, what could you look forward to? Who else can you support? No, I mean, come on. That just doesn't happen. I mean, ChatGPT, even that should understand. You don't change the team you support.

[00:39:05] But, you know, there's, you know, it listed out some reasons that there's a lot to look forward to next season. Not sure if I believed it. Cheaper ticket prices. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Get to see Lincoln City come to the, one of the best stadiums in the world. Yeah. Blackburn Rovers is probably the closest ground to me. Um, so, well, one of the closest grounds to me so that you could, you can pop, you can pop up.

[00:39:35] So we're away again at Blackburn. So there's many, there's many positives. Many positives. Yeah. Might be difficult to see. No. No. There's a few, few weeks left. I think you'd, I think you'd be all right, actually. I think you'd be all right. Well, again, the stats that they use on the BBC website driven by AI have us down. It's, it's between us and West Ham. Yeah. We have a, we have a much higher probability of going down.

[00:40:04] I mean, this could, we could do a whole episode just on, on why this has happened, but yeah. Don't want to go there. No. And I feel like, um, um, my little bundle of joy for me, like mine, you're like, yeah, your energy's just dropped a little bit now. Um, sorry about the, uh, the Tottenham thing. Can I help? Yeah. Yeah. I, if you were, yeah, we could sign you and you could play against Villa away on Sunday. Yeah.

[00:40:33] I don't, I'm not sure that would help. Not sure that would help. No. You'll be, you'll be all right though. You will be all right. Whatever happens. That's the spirit. Yeah. Whatever happens, you'll be, you'll be fine. Exactly. You will be fine. And maybe, maybe the same is true when we think about AI. It's all going to be all right in the end. Yeah. No, dead right. It is. If we face into it in the right way and with the actual intention to not forget the person,

[00:40:58] um, like we, we believe that people are the greatest, greatest assets in any organization. Um, and, and as long as we collectively as society maintain that belief, um, then we will absolutely be fine. And there you go, everyone. Um, I can, I can confirm this. I have not been talking to a deep fake of Lee. He hasn't got, I would have removed the lines if that was the curse.

[00:41:27] And maybe we could have both had a nice head of hair. Yeah. Yeah. Do you prefer it? So, um, uh, ever since, uh, Tuesday when, when my daughter India said we look like brothers, I, I quite like me look now. So, uh, cause you're, you're a fine looking man, Martin. And on that bombshell. Yeah. Thank you, Yoda. Oh, no. Pleasure all mine. Cheers, man. See you, mate. Bye.